They had it coming
Remember the charming Peyton Rose, who wants to see “TERFs” punched in the throat? Trans Pride Scotland issued a statement on Rose’s ugly threats:
We at Trans Pride Scotland were today asked to comment on the activity surrounding a tweet made by one of our performers, Payton Rose. In our statement, we made clear that we have a policy against violence and harassment at our events, and while that remains true, we feel some clarity is needed after today’s press releases.
We believe that Payton has been unfairly represented by her detractors and the press, especially those who have a history of transphobic activity. While her tweet was certainly inflammatory and may have caused concern for many people, we stand by her response that is was a “tongue in cheek” comment, made in a state of vulnerability and stress and in self defence.
See this is, among other things, one of the ways the conditioning comes into play. We see all those “hers” and we are conditioned into thinking of Peyton Rose (of the pretty flower name) as vulnerable in the sense women are vulnerable. But Peyton Rose is a trans woman and so doesn’t have a vulnerable female body. Peyton Rose has the kind of body that is a threat to people who do have vulnerable female bodies…but the wording has done its bit to erase that from our unconscious minds.
The world is not kind to trans people, especially trans women.
Same again. Really? The world is more unkind to trans women than to trans men?
Groups like For Women Scotland and A Women’s Place and activists who share their values consider themselves allies to the trans community, but nothing could be further from the truth. These groups continue to spread the rhetoric that we are nothing more than dangerous men, that trans kids don’t exist, and that our rights to legal recognition should be undone.
But it’s not rhetoric. Trans women are men and as such have the potential to be dangerous to women, which is not something women should be bullied into forgetting or trying to ignore. When a man talks about throat punching women, it’s not fair to tell women to shrug it off or even feel guilty over it. But Trans Pride Scotland does just that.
Payton has not been removed from Trans Pride Scotland. After lengthy discussion with our committee, she has taken the decision to withdraw for her own safety, as we were becoming concerned at the level of harassment she was recieving on and offline. This includes some anti-trans activists finding her address, her deadname and pictures of her pre-transition. This is transphobic abuse and is a clear indicator that these people do not care about her wellbeing or her comments, but instead have used her in an attempt to discredit and undermine our movement as a whole, and we now believe that we have a duty as a community to come together at this time in solidarity, and protect one of our own from ongoing hate.
Our march and event is continuing. We invite all trans people and true allies to attend and join with us in protest and celebration of 50 years of activism since the Stonewall riots, where trans women of colour were at the vanguard of the movement that brought us here today. We hope to see you in Dundee on the 30th.
In love and solidarity,
Trans Pride Scotland
Never mind Peyton Rose’s fantasy about throat punching women, because those women deserve it. In love and solidarity, Trans Pride Scotland.
Interesting to see who gets the benefit of the doubt.
When *I* make a comment about punching you in the throat, it should be understood in context and I should be granted every presumption of good faith.
When *you* make a reference to, say, “pregnancy is a women’s issue,” it is not simply an ordinary way of saying something that is true in the vast majority of cases, but rather, your failure to include the small percentage of the population who can get pregnant but do not consider themselves women is obviously meant as an insult to those exceptions and a desire that they commit suicide and, really, is tantamount to a punch in the throat.
Also, trans women of color started the gay rights movement again.
And are these “anti-trans” activists saying that trans kids “don’t exist”? Or are they saying that no one really understands what trans kids are experiencing and that surgical and medical interventions might not be as harmless and wonderful as the advocates claim?
(Isn’t it shocking that saying that is taken to be the same as saying, “Trans kids don’t exist and to hell with them”? Then again, saying, “Prostitution harms women and we should change laws to protect them” is taken to mean, “We hate prostitutes and don’t believe they have rights.”)
There’s just so many transwomen of colour in Scotland… Not bloody likely…
Somebody needs to learn that allies do not necessarily share the same ideology. An extreme example would be the Western alliance during WWII including Russia, an alliance formed in the face of a common enemy, but certainly not one with shared ideals or values.
Do they not realise that by turning on their allies so often and so viciously, the trans activists are driving those allies away? By doing so, they are not only alienating themselves, they are in danger of alienating the (I assume) majority of trans people who don’t want to make waves and just want to quietly live in their chosen identity, but who will almost inevitably become tainted by association.
And yet again, PZ (I know, I apologise) comes so close yet still fails to make that little leap. He quotes from a post on a blog called Driftglass, about the cult-like behaviour of Republicans:
He then adds his own two-penn’orth.
So bloody near, yet so bloody far.
Not content with special pleading for the violent rhetoric of one of their own, Trans Pride Scotland rewrites history as well.
Storme Delarverie is credited with starting the Stonewall riots. Storme Delarverie was a butch lesbian. Marsha P. Johnson, often named as an important figure in the riots, was a drag queen who has been posthumously trans-ed.
When I threaten to punch you in the throat it’s tongue in cheek and I’m a fragile flower. When you say trans women are in fact men, it’s literal violence, and justifies my threatening to punch you in the throat. (Better get some barbed-wire-wrapped baseball bats, too, TPS, just to be safe.)
No, these groups express the beliefs that trans women are men, no more or less dangerous than other men, that gender dysphoric children are likely being transitioned and medicalized too quickly due to pressure from trans ideologues, and that “legal representation”–i.e., the ability to be legally recognized as the sex one isn’t–should not be a simple matter of self-declaration. FTFY, Trans Pride Scotland, ya wankers.
Descartes for the 21st century: I say – therefore I am. And because I am, all other considerations are moot. and it is bigotry to test the soundness of my argument.
One of my many challenges in life is that I have a hard time compartmentalizing. I look at the criticisms leveled against people for the many variations of alleged cultural appropriation and have to wonder why the same principle never applies to women. The point of one of my comics: http://farcornercafe.blogspot.com/2019/03/the-changeling.html
Screechy Monkey, I had the exact same thought while reading this. ‘I don’t think trans women are women’ is DOING LITERAL VIOLENCE TO A OPPRESSED GROUP but ‘punch women in the throat’ is something we should stand behind.
Oh, the poor dear is now supposedly in fear for his own safety? Yeah, doesn’t feel good, does it? Welcome to how Peyton Rose and his fellow misogynist make real women feel all the time. And I will agree with this nonsense on one point — I don’t care about this violent man’s wellbeing at all.
This goddamn psychological self-defence excuse again. Give me strength!
How about it’s not OK for people to advocate violence and it’s definitely not OK for male bodied people to advocate violence against female bodied people who, in all likelihood, can’t defend themselves adequately against such an assault?
What the fuck happened to “intent isn’t magic”? It doesn’t fucking matter what your intention was, asshole. What you effectively communicated was a threat of physical assault which terrified people.
Why don’t trans women have to be responsible for the words they use and the harm they cause? We’ve all said stupid shit when stressed. Most of us have been expected to apologise for it and not repeat the behaviour.
“We have a policy against violence and harassment at our events, and while that remains true, we would like to now deliver 300-odd words on why violence and harassment is fine”.
Secret corollary to our stance against violence and harassment #1: You are exempt if you are in the right.
Secret corollary to our stance against violence and harassment #2: We are in the right.
LM @ #7
what does TPS stand for?
I wonder what the “harassment” and “abuse” he received online and offline consists of? I’m not a big fan of publishing people’s home address, but “deadnaming”? and publishing pre-transition photos? really? saying true things about a person’s history is harassment and abuse now? MUCH worse than “punch her in the throat”!
“(I assume) majority of trans people who don’t want to make waves and just want to quietly live in their chosen identity”
I no longer believe this is a reasonable assumption. How do we know this? Is it just because it’s nicer to believe it?
What evidence do we have that “the vast majority of trans people” —-and how are we defining that category—are simply quiet and not interested in public display or provocation?
I don’t believe that. Not with the modern anything-goes definition of “trans”. I think instead it’s a toxic identity that attracts disordered people preferentially, and out of proportion.
There is no such thing as “simply trans, and in no way mentally ill or disordered in any way that makes them distinguishable from the average person on the street.”
maddog @ 14: TPS=Trans Pride Scotland.
It’s an interesting point about how do we know the majority is just plain folks (crude summary). I do think the core idea is fundamentally crankish, because it just is possible to feel discomfort with the social meaning(s) of one’s sex without coming to believe that one is in truth and reality and every other way the other sex. If the core idea is fundamentally crankish, how likely is it to attract people who don’t want to make waves and just want to quietly live in their chosen identity?
I don’t know, but I wonder.
I wish I had some kind of intelligent response to Josh, as I was one of those ‘live and let live, whatever’ people up until the recent unpleasantness (I was never keen on the men who chose to participate in women’s events, but in my experience they kept quiet and stayed out of the way, so I was, again, one of those women who just thought ‘leave them alone, they’re not doing any harm’), but emotionally at least I’ve come to the same conclusion. In recent months I’ve thought, when encountering the handful of trans women I’ve run into (none of whom I’ve had to deal with for more than a night) I think ‘this person’s view of what people are like, and how the world works, is so fundamentally different from mine that I just don’t think we can communicate in a meaningful way’. I was saying to a friend the other day that this doesn’t keep me from feeling like I can communicate with, say, religious people, but I just don’t think anyone who’d label themselves ‘trans’ and I have enough in common for there to be any kind of understanding.
I’ve never encountered a trans person in meat life who engaged in the trans advocacy or held the trans ideology I’ve seen online in which womanhood has nothing to do with biology or socialisation and upbringing and the violent threats of trans women towards women are totes acceptable if you just think about them really hard. I’ve never ever met a trans man who behaved remotely like the nutty trans women online do. I hope it stays that way.