Year: 2010

  • A loose end

    So, as I mentioned, a late reply to Mooney’s post about me on July 12.

    We stopped allowing Benson to comment here back in mid 2009, for very good reasons–among other things, she was sending us emails demanding to have other posters’ comments deleted. We had a better solution.

    You can read the thread where they made this reasonable decision. My comments are numbers 35, 37, 90 and 92. They’re not flamey. Then at 104 we get TB:

    When Ophelia Benson claims through her “questions” that Chris and Sheril have no evidence she is not telling the truth. It’s one thing for people who haven’t read the book to assert this – she has the book.
    So let me say that again and more emphatically: She is lying…

    Benson doesn’t just disagree. She lies and asserts that they have nothing to back up their assertions…

    Benson is a troll – she’s added nothing to the conversation and deliberately misleads people about the content of the book. She has her own site to do that on – ban her here.

    I asked M&K to delete the assertions that I was lying – I didn’t “demand,” I asked – but they did what TB demanded instead, and banned me shortly after that. I think that’s disgusting. Today, on the other hand, Mooney deleted part of a comment by Hitch, that Hitch then posted elsewhere:

    And how Jean used snide remarks against New Atheists throughout.

    That’s it – that’s what Hitch wrote, that’s what Mooney deleted. His rules are somewhat arbitrary.

    The whole of the rest of the post deals with the fact that I said it was “bilbo” who called me a liar; my mistake, it was TB. That makes M&K look even worse, actually, because TB (Tim Broderick) is still a valued commenter, who has just succeeded in bullying Hitch off the Intersection. “bilbo” was one of “Tom Johnson”‘s sock puppets, but TB is a real and trusted regular fan and commenter – who announces that people are lying when they’re not. I should have checked again, of course; I should have gotten the right name; but the defense of allowing their fans to call their critics liars while preventing the critics from replying is not convincing. It’s also distasteful that it is made on a post where the comments are closed. It was distasteful on the “new atheists are medieval witch hunters baying for blood” post at Talking Philosophy, it was distasteful on the “Believe Me” post at Kazez’s blog, and it’s distasteful in Mooney’s post about me.

  • Incomplete

    Mooney has done another “What Tom Johnson has taught Me” post. It repairs some previous omissions, so it is a small improvement, but it is flawed.

    I regret that I gave this story undue prominence, and I want to apologize to all who were affected by that action.

    No he doesn’t, not really. As usual, he omits some people, so he doesn’t want to apologize to all who were affected by that action. He doesn’t want to apologize to me, for instance. I was affected by that action. He shouldn’t give himself the moral credit for a blanket apology when he’s not in fact making one.

    Mooney goes on to insinuate that gnu atheists did something to make Tom Johnson so crazy – but – that is

    no justification for the trumped-up original story or for his other actions—which, as we now know, included creating multiple sock puppets over a long period of time and using them to nastily trash his “New Atheist” opponents.

    Yes, and it was Mooney who hosted those sock puppets; it was Mooney who banned me for asking him questions about his book while allowing those sock puppets to trash-talk about his gnu atheist opponents, for months. Mooney helped to create the climate in which TJ grew and festered. Mooney obviously liked the nasty trashing of the gnu atheist opponents; that’s obvious because Mooney has a very quick hand with the delete button, so if he doesn’t delete something, it’s safe to assume that he likes it. TJ is the child of Mooney – that is, a product of the vituperative atmosphere Mooney created.

    We are left with no reliable evidence of loud, boorish, confrontational public behavior by atheists at events with religious believers. Those who have problems with the “New Atheism” should not use this line of argument in their critiques, unless or until such evidence is produced.

    We never had any such reliable evidence. We’ve had ten months with this lie out there, painting gnu atheists as rude stupid belligerent vulgarians. It’s ten months too late to say we have no reliable evidence for that now. We never did have. Mooney should have been able to see that last October.

    Jean Kazez…has been sorely and unjustly abused online over this affair…

    Bullshit. She’s been disputed and criticised, not abused and not unjustly. She wasn’t, for instance, called anything even approaching “useless putrid twat.” I was. Kazez was not subject to any misogynist raving, but I was. Yet Mooney weeps crocodile tears for Kazez and doesn’t mention me. Mooney probably realizes that he did a lot to create TJ and his sock puppets, and thus that he did a lot to inspire the sewage that TJ and his socks flung at me; but he doesn’t mention me. Mooney is at fault here, but he doesn’t mention it. His post is, as I mentioned, incomplete.

    In conclusion, I want to thank everyone who has tried to establish and to explain the truth here: “Johnson’s” adviser and Jerry Coyne; and also TB and Jean Kazez.

    That’s another one of those fake blankets. I did a lot more to try to establish the truth “here” than TB and Kazez did. I also did in fact point some of it out a hell of a lot sooner than they did – starting last October. So when Mooney says “everyone” he is misleading the reader; he doesn’t mean “everyone” at all. He doesn’t, for instance, mean me. Well he should. I suspect he knows he should. But he won’t admit it.

    Furthermore, to repeat, TB is not a truth-seeker. TB called me a liar just for asking M&K a list of questions about their book. I was not lying when I did that. TB is not an honest broker here.

    I’m disturbed that someone on my “side” of this debate would do the things “Johnson” has done, painting a group as uncivil based on what is at best a serious exaggeration, while simultaneously spewing reams of incivility towards that group online, under multiple identities. There is no excuse for such behavior–and moreover, there has been a very big cost in this case to a lot of people, both in time and in grief.

    Quite, and I’m the one who got the worst of the spewed reams of incivility; yet Mooney never mentions me throughout the post.

    If there is any silver lining at all here, perhaps after working to find out the truth together about “Tom Johnson,” so-called “New Atheists” and “accommodationists” might feel the inclination to be just a little bit more civil and trusting towards one another. We do have a shared commitment to the truth, and a means of discerning it—and those have won out in this case. Let’s not forget that as we carry on the argument for science and reason in the future.

    Oh dear god. Mooney is the one who picked this fight, and then went on picking it and picking it and picking it – pissing on gnu atheists in every major media outlet that invited him, for months – yet he pretends both sides are equally to blame. And as for the shared commitment to truth…………that’s just beyond even ridicule. Let’s not forget that Chris Mooney is the last person in the world to be giving advice on either “civility” or truth-seeking.

  • Do alligators count as fish for Catholics?

    No. Do Catholics count as lunch for alligators? Yes.

  • Saira, 19, recalls attempted honour killing

    “My mum said, ‘He is your husband, even if he kills you we don’t care’.”

  • Sherrod plans to sue Breitbart

    Brent Bozell, of right-wing Media Research Center, said “I hope this champion of honesty will stop lying about Fox News.”

  • Gove welcomes “atheist” schools

    Because he thinks a secular school is an “atheist” school.

  • UK govt response to petition to ban halal slaughter

    “The Government recognises the needs of certain communities” to kill animals without stunning them first.

  • Extended interview with Hitchens

    “I’ve only got one side of the brain that works. The other is sort of walnut-sized. I think I’d do better to stay with the essayistic form.”

  • Ron Lindsay on how to discuss religion

    Religious truth-claims should be subject to examination and criticism, just like any other claims about reality.

  • Visible or Invisible: Growing up Female in a Porn Culture

    At a lecture I was giving in a large West Coast university in the Spring of 2008, the female students talked extensively about how much they preferred to have a completely waxed pubic area as it made them feel “clean,” “hot” and “well groomed.”  As they excitedly insisted that they themselves chose to have a Brazilian wax, one student let slip that her boyfriend had complained when she decided to give up on waxing. Then there was silence. I asked the student to say more about her boyfriend’s preferences and how she felt about his criticism. As she started to speak other students joined in, only now the conversation took a very different turn. The excitement in the room gave way to a subdued discussion on how some boyfriends had even refused to have sex with non-waxed girlfriends as they “looked gross.”  One student told the group how her boyfriend bought her a waxing kit for Valentine’s Day, while yet another sent out an email to his friends joking about his girlfriend’s “hairy beaver.” No, she did not break up with him, she got waxed instead.

    Two weeks after the waxing discussion, I was at an East Coast Ivy League school where some female students became increasingly angry. They accused me of denying them free choice in their embrace of our hypersexualized porn culture. As the next generation’s elite women, this idea was especially repugnant because they saw no limits or constraints on them as women. Literally two minutes later, one of the students made a joke about the “trick” that many of them employ as a way to avoid hookup sex. What is this trick? These women purposely don’t shave or wax as they are getting ready to go out that night, so they will feel too embarrassed to participate in hookup sex. As she spoke, I watched as others nodded their heads in agreement. When I asked why they couldn’t just say no to sex, they informed me that once you have a few drinks in you, and are at a party or a bar, it is too hard to say no. I was speechless, not least because they had just been arguing that I had denied them agency in my discussion of porn culture, and yet they saw no contradiction in telling me that they didn’t have the agency to say no to sex. The next day I flew to Utah to give a lecture in a small college, which although not a religious college, had a good percentage of Mormons and Catholics. I told them about the lecture the previous night and asked them if they knew what the trick was. It turns out that trick is everywhere, including Utah.

    I tell this story because, on many levels, it neatly captures how the porn culture is affecting young women’s lives. The reality is that women don’t need to look at porn to be profoundly affected by it because images, representations, and messages of porn are now delivered to women via pop culture. Women today are still not major consumers of hard-core porn; they are, however, whether they know or it or not, internalizing porn ideology, an ideology that often masquerades as advice on how to be hot, rebellious, and cool in order to attract and  keep a man. An excellent example is genital waxing, which first became popular in porn (not least because it makes the women look pre-pubescent) and then filtered down into women’s media such as Cosmopolitan, a magazine that regularly features stories and tips on what “grooming” methods women should adopt to attract a man. Sex and the City, that hugely successful show with an almost cult following, also used waxing as a storyline. For instance, in the movie, Miranda is chastised by Samantha for “letting herself go” by having pubic hair.

    ….The Stepford Wife image that drove previous generations of women crazy with their sparkling floors and perfectly orchestrated meals has all but disappeared, and in its place we now have the Stepford Slut; a hypersexualized, young, thin, toned, hairless, technologically, and in many cases surgically-enhanced, woman with a come-hither look on her face. We all recognize the look: slightly parted glossy lips, head tilted to the side, inviting eyes, and a body contorted to give the (presumed male) viewer maximum gazing rights to her body.   Harriet Nelson and June Cleaver have morphed into Britney, Rhianna, Beyonce, Paris, Lindsay and so on. They represent images of contemporary idealized femininity – in a word, hot – that are held up for women, especially young women, to emulate. Women today are still held captive by images that ultimately tell lies about women. The biggest lie is that conforming to this hypersexualized image will give women real power in the world, since in a porn culture, our power lies, we are told, not in our ability to shape the institutions that determine our life chances, but in having a hot body that men desire and women envy.

    In today’s image-based culture, there is no escaping the image and no respite from its power when it is relentless in its visibility. If you think that I am exaggerating, then flip through a magazine at the supermarket checkout, channel surf, take a drive to look at billboards or watch TV ads. Many of these images are of celebrities – women who have fast become the role models of today. As they grace the pages of People, US Weekly, Entertainment Weekly, and Vanity Fair, they seem to effortlessly pull together the hot look as they walk the red carpet, stroll the aisles of the supermarket or hit the nightclubs of New York and Cannes. With their wealth, designer clothes, expensive homes and flashy lifestyles, these women do seem enviable to girls and young women since they appear to embody a type of power that demands attention and visibility.

    … People not immersed in pop culture tend to assume that what we see today is just more of the same stuff that previous generations grew up on. After all, every generation has had its hot and sultry stars who led expensive and wild lives compared to the rest of us. But what is different about today is not only the hypersexualization of the image, but also the degree to which such images have overwhelmed and crowded out any alternative images of being female. Today’s tidal wave of soft-core porn images has normalized the porn star look in everyday culture to such a degree that anything less looks dowdy, prim and downright boring. Today a girl or young woman looking for an alternative to the Britney, Paris, Lindsay look will soon come to the grim realization that the only alternative to looking fuckable is to be invisible.

    This is an excerpt from chapter 6 of Gail Dines’s new book, Pornland: How porn has hijacked our sexuality, published by permission.

    About the Author

    Dr. Gail Dines is a professor of sociology and women’s studies at Wheelock College in Boston, an internationally acclaimed speaker and author, and a feminist activist. Her writing and lectures focus on the hypersexualization of the culture and the ways that porn images filter down into mainstream pop culture.
  • Lauryn Oates on cultural relativism and FGM

    Why do we worry so much about alienating people who hold down screaming little girls and butcher their genitals?

  • What we can do

    Christina Patterson accepts a little too much.

     I accept that people should, except in certain professional situations which involve dealing with the public, be allowed to wear whatever they like, and that laws which prevent this are self-defeating, and that you can’t stop parents, or rabbis, teaching little boys that adult women shouldn’t even be brushed against on a bus, and I accept that some of these things are an inevitable consequence of a modern, and in many ways magnificent, multi-cultural society.

    I don’t think we have to accept that you can’t stop parents, or rabbis, teaching little boys that adult women are contaminants. We have to accept that you can’t forcibly, physically stop them, but we don’t have to accept that you can’t slowly and carefully and fairly stop them by teaching them better. We don’t have to just shrug and say “oh well if parents or rabbis want to teach little boys that women are filthy, there’s nothing we can do about it.” Yes there is, and we have to do what we can about it, just as we do if parents or clerics are teaching children that black people, or dalits, or Jews, or foreigners, or atheists are filthy. We have to do what we can, consistent with liberal norms of freedom and autonomy, to counter ideas of that kind: ideas that are baseless and harmful and at the extreme dangerous.

  • Gnu atheists close the bar

    It was fun last night. PZ was there, Cam and Josh were there, and about thirty other interesting people were there. We bayed for blood, we cooked little children into soup, we tore up holy books, we made plans for world domination. The usual.

  • UK: agencies tackling “faith-based abuse”

    Progress has been made, but some churches decline “help”; they still abuse children as “witches.”

  • Ashtiani’s cellmate was there when she was sentenced

    “She just cried and I didn’t see her without crying until the last day I spent time with her in prison.”

  • Multiculturalism and its discontents

    Little boys treating women like sources of contamination; racism; female genital mutilation.

  • Counterproductive Online Journalism

    It is said that rejection is just the things you say to yourself everyday, except said by someone else. To a failed writer, this balance of rejection is firmly in the court of the rejecting editors encountered to date at this stage, but the maxim is similar in the world of Web 2.0. Blogs, comments, forums, social networking, it’s the stuff you say in your head, except communicated as text, but the difference is it’s unlikely you would say them to anyone’s face (at least not sober).

    However, this caveat is often used to somehow dampen the impact of the internet. It’s just the internet; no one takes it seriously do they? Well, do they? As the print media will attest, we’ve changed forever how we get our news and opinion. As technology like smart phones and the new generation of iPads become inseparable from our hands, so the internet becomes the basis for our information. Those who scorn blogs for their highly agenda driven information ignore that the traditional media has had to mirror this to survive. That is the greatest proof of just how important Web 2.0 has become in shaping and influencing society.

    With the advent of blogs as a news source, if not the main news source for many, journalists can no longer look at their blogs and features as a “hobby”. The old view of “it’s just the internet” is no longer a valid argument for relaxed journalistic standards. While a journalist has many competitors out there and the instantaneous nature of social networking mean a “scoop” is a brittle thing where weeks and months of work can be scooped by some tool on twitter, if the revolution is to be lasting and worthwhile, those standards of journalism (built on 400 years of print media) must be transferred over into all writings.

    When Chris Mooney, an individual of significant journalistic experience, let confirmation bias corrupt every journalistic ethic and promoted a fabricated anecdote as the smoking gun in his whole theory of New Atheist Battle Royal, do we say: “it’s just a blog” or “it’s just the internet”? The problem in the case of Mooney (and other online journalists) is that they want their blogs to be read and they want their blogs to be viewed with a sense of respectability and credibility. This isn’t a blog about the daily habits of his dog, this is a blog on a scientific webzine written by a science journalist purporting to present factual information.

    It’s always easy to judge with 20/20 hindsight, but there are grievous sins a journalist should avoid (or at least not get caught doing) and if journalists wish their online writing to be as respected and credible as their print, then they must apply the same ethics to their blogs as to their copy.

     “Journalism’s first obligation is to the truth, its essence is in the discipline or verification” (Kovach and Rosenstiel.)

    The greatest failing of most online journalists operating today is the failure to remember or even know this core belief, largely because it is counterproductive to their own writings to do so. What’s the point in having a view, promulgating that view and selling that view when the truth ends up contradicting something you wrote with passion only hours before? The first obligation of a journalist has become the first obligatory disposable principle of Web 2.0. Like changing a diaper, the truth is necessary and essential, but it’s preferable if someone else is lumbered with the dirty work.

    However, the real virtue of this principle is that you have to exercise all due care to verify the truth. It’s a cliché, but early on in every journalist’s training is the statement “if your mother tells you she loves you, you’re sceptical”. Everything written and everything stated should be the truth (or as close as thorough prudent checking will allow).

    Parallels are drawn between this case and other such journalistic failures. Putting it simply: there is no comparison. Even the much more controversial Breitbart case isn’t comparable. While the content and the context of the Breitbart case are more emotive, Breitbart was approached by someone with a story and he decided to run with it without any verification. Mooney’s failure is an even greater breach of these principles. He wasn’t approached; there was no flower pot on the balcony and meetings in car parks. Mooney took what is the written version of a vox pop and elevated one individual comment to a story and categorically stated it was the truth.

    As was very quickly shown, Breitbart could have verified his “story”, but Mooney didn’t have a story to verify; there was no story until he decided one person’s comments were more worthy of elevation than any other. That’s not journalism, that’s not even on a par with celebrity gossip, it’s taking the equivalent of a conversation overheard on a bus, making a story out of it and presenting it as the truth.

    Mooney claimed the anecdote was “Exhibit A”, the smoking gun; by that virtue he owed it to everyone who read his work and those implicated by the anecdote to verify it is true. By his own admission he didn’t.

    It was only after others expressed concern at the anecdote that he did some checking. By then, the damage was done.

    The Egg Shell Skull Rule

    Whatever is at the heart of Mooney’s general reasoning and whether you agree or disagree, what is implied in his “Exhibit A” is that journalists, authors and commentators are responsible for what people, their followers, do or are influenced to do with their words. This point can’t be argued with and there have been serious concerns with some media agencies regarding “incitement”. However, how far does this extend in Mooney’s case? While it may be true that his tea and cake approach to atheism isn’t likely to cause riots, the use of Exhibit A was to state that there was an actual example of people being harassed by the supporters of Dawkins, Myers et al. Why run with that repeated lie if it wasn’t to confirm his views that Dawkins and Myers should be somehow accountable for their follower’s actions?

    Yet, Mooney is very quick to play the Pontius Pilate when it comes to his own words. Whoever the origin of the lie is, Mooney has effectively discharged the exact same responsibility he expects other commentators to be held to by claiming, falsely, that he was hoaxed. Being somewhat generous with English and admitting that Dawkins and Myers can be a little “forthright in their views”, Mooney elevated one person’s lie to be the sole feature of that post, then went on to publically “thank” the individual in a separate post for their “story”. What responsibility does Mooney take for elevating this individual’s story and all that followed?

    It’s not an open and shut case just how far journalists are responsible and even though the potential for an incitement charge exists, it is extremely rare. For example, a much worse case of media incitement happened in the UK when the News of the World whipped up paedophilia paranoia by publishing the details of known “sex offenders” and like something from the Simpsons, the good people of England (in this case) went on to carrying pitchforks and attacking the home of a “paediatrician” (based upon all paedophiles have brass plaques on their doors stating what they are).

    Hardly comparable to promoting one small lie as Mooney did, but that’s not the point here, it’s the consistency in Mooney’s argument. The reason for “Exhibit A” was that it confirmed his view that getting hot under the collar in a book or a blog will incite the readers of that to go out and cause mayhem in the parish church hall. The reason for his unquestionable belief in “Exhibit A” was that he believed it backed up his notion that Dawkins and Myers must take responsibility for the words they produce. Yet when it comes to his words, no such responsibility is forthcoming and that’s the point: you can’t argue for one and refuse to accept your own responsibility when it happens to you. Well you can, but you have to be a politician to get away with it.

    The Hoax to End all Hoaxes

    Except that it wasn’t a hoax at all. In the same way that if I heard someone on the bus chattering away about some libellous gossip and I pass that on (note: I always pass on libellous gossip overheard on the bus), if I’m caught in passing on a lie, I cannot claim to be hoaxed. Here’s how hoaxes work: generally someone comes up to you with an unbelievable scoop, chance in a lifetime, Pulitzer Prize stuff, you listen to them and go back to your editor. After some general whoops and pats on the back, some checks are made as to the veracity of what is being claimed as quietly as possible. You feel happy enough, hand over the money, run the story, get caught out within a few hours, you get sacked, the editor resigns and the newspaper is forever tarnished with the reputation of the hoax.

    How hoaxes don’t work: you read a comment on your own blog among the hundreds of other blogs. Think to yourself, that’s exactly what I said would happen! Viking New Atheists, raping and pillaging their way through small community religious meetings. I must run with this. Then a few hours from filing the story and after hearing a few people saying it sounds a bit dodgy, you check up on who the individual was (though not their story). Happy that when the person confirms to you they are actually a person with a name a couple of legs and a head, you sit back, job done. When it’s all shown to be a lie, you deny the lie for a while, say that even though the individual is a bit of a cad, it could be true somewhere in the world, but just not in this case. Then when it really becomes obvious that you really did fail as a journalist, say you were hoaxed.

    There was no hoax. To say it was a hoax is to put all the blame on the individual’s anecdote Mooney identified and quoted all by himself. Mooney is transferring full responsibility onto the person he’s having the good grace to protect below.

    Like Woodward and Bernstein I’ll take the name of the source with me to the grave

    Some honourable journalists have chosen a prison sentence rather than name a source. And rightly so; the source may have come forward with news that, if they were identified, could put their livelihoods and lives in danger. In order to protect them and all future sources, journalists are told to keep their mouths closed at all costs. Those who don’t, those who confess all, are ostracised from the journalism community.

    So on paper, it’s an honourable thing Mooney is doing. He’s sticking by his man and for the sake of the poor soul, he’ll keep his name away from publication. But, “he” isn’t a source and it is another attempt to legitimise and defend the egregious failure of “Exhibit A”. By calling him a source, Mooney is trying to pretend he was approached with the story: that’s what sources do, they come to you. But by Mooney’s admission that never happened, Mooney quoted a lie without even a single effort to verify the claim. 

    There are other aspects preventing Mooney from naming the individual, like internet privacy, but they’re a legal matter and nothing to do with ethics. It’s perhaps even more galling that an attempt is being made to hide behind journalistic ethics despite the obvious and blatant disregard for all the other ethical aspects of journalism.

    The name of the source isn’t important. How likely his story was to be true isn’t important. The fact is it wasn’t true; that’s the end of the matter. Even if it was true, that’s irrelevant because Mooney ran the story without even checking if it were. How many other posts of his have suffered from this same lack of checking? How many other blogs on Discovery are subject to the same lack of editorial standards? How many other bloggers on Discovery are permitted to publically admit they ignored the first tenet of journalism without apology and retain their status within the magazine?

    Forget the smokescreen of who the individual was who recounted the anecdote. Forget what he then went on to do with this sudden and public confirmation of his position in society. The fundamental failure, the first failure was on Mooney; everything that followed came from that single solitary lack of consideration and responsibility that is with anyone purporting to be a journalist.

  • Faith-healing in Oregon

    Take a look at Alayna Wyland, age 8 months, and the untreated hemangioma over her eye.

  • The worst thing to be is an Afghan woman

    Stories abound of young women betrothed as toddlers, exchanged for fighting dogs or to pay debts, beaten and raped by their husbands.

  • Arundhati Roy the reactionary

    Roy has chosen to make progress—along with democracy—her bête noire.