So that must mean that God hates gorillas? Because if He was really on the ball, He could have saved both the kid and the gorilla; no need to shoot a member of a rapidly declining species to save a member of the species that is causing their decline. He could have saved them both.
Just terrible that she seems to think that the life of a four-year-old child is somehow more important than that of a zoo animal. Now if only it was somone else’s child, maybe she would be a bit more reasonable…
Don’t be so stupid. The point is not that the gorilla’s life is “more important” (whatever that may mean), it’s that she shouldn’t have completely ignored the gorilla and the part she played, however inadvertently, in his killing.
Four-year-olds are wriggly and curious and it’s impossible to”never let them out of your sight for a second.” I got lost on a high street at about that age, and my mother wasn’t neglectful, she was just momentarily distracted by my little brother. And I’ll bet the same happened to most kids at one time or another.
I blame the zoo for not having better protection against children falling in.
To those of us who eat meat and know where it comes from, the life of an individual animal is of no account in comparison to that of a human being, let alone a four-year-old human being. Should she also have publicly mourned all the animals slaughtered for her family’s dinner table?
This mass outrage over her failure to live up to her social media-defined role is just bizarre.
Am I the only one who thinks far too much vitriol is being directed at almost all the humans involved in this tragedy? Yes, including the mom (or the kid, or the zookeepers, if that’s who you’ve been blaming personally.)
It’s a matter of seconds for a kid to get someplace they don’t belong, in most cases. Short of putting them on leashes (and yes, I’ve seen those), it really is an inhuman demand to insist on absolutely perfect parenting. Hell, I once managed to disappear for hours, sending my entire church into a panic when I was five. Took them forever to figure out that I’d managed to squirrel myself away in the back of a coat closet and fallen asleep–then hid, because I felt guilty about missing Palm Sunday Mass.
Had I been a slightly different child, I could’ve been out the door and down the street into abandoned lots littered with glass and rusty cans in that amount of time. And I was considered one of the ‘good’ kids who would never actively seek out trouble. Fact is, most parents never have to learn how often they got lucky that their kid survived to adulthood.
And do I really need to point out how utterly misogynistic some of this lashing out has been? I’ve seen more than one post online to the effect of, “They should have shot the mother and left the kid with the gorilla.”
And I can guarantee that there’s not a single staffer at the zoo who isn’t in mourning over this. Ripping on them, or the zoo’s management, for the decisions made in a desperate situation is almost as unseemly. (I’ll also note that the zoo has had a 38-year solid safety record; they most likely reasonably decided that their current safeguards were adequate to the task.)
((Okay, ignore the rhetorical flourish at the beginning of this post, since YoSaffBridge @9 managed to ninja me on the sentiment.)
Freemage, no, you’re not the only one – Josh Spokes for one did a thoughtful post on the subject yesterday.
But I’m not sure if you’re saying I and maybe others are directing too much vitriol here? Having seen Josh’s post I tried to avoid aiming vitriol at Michelle Gregg, but I do disagree with the cheerful tone of her post and especially her shout-out to awesome god.
I don’t need to be told the zoo staffers are devastated. I was a zookeeper for several years and believe me, I know that all too well – I shudder to think about how the keepers feel. (On the other hand I was a little consoled when I learned how many gorillas they have, and how recently Harambe had arrived there.)
I know some of the lashing out has been misogynistic, but mine hasn’t, so…? I’m not sure what you’re objecting to?
Jib Halyard, so you’re not at all familiar with ethical concerns about animals that have more elaborate consciousnesses than say cattle? You think of all animals as on one simple level, the not-human level, and as worthless except as food for humans? That’s a widely shared view, of course, but it’s not particularly interesting.
Sorry for the lack of clarity in my post. I was more or less venting after spending the weekend reading that sort of vile mess, not meant to direct at your post specifically.
I certainly agree with the almost boilerplate-at-this-point objection to “God’s intervention” that never seems to be particularly useful or accurate for an allegedly omniscient and omnipotent deity.
I did read her post with a bit more charity than you, perhaps–I suspect there’s a lot of defensive reaction on her part to the internet pillorying that she’s been receiving, so she’s trying to put on a good face.
I had not known you were a zookeeper; it must’ve been fascinating work.
It was. I decided to get into it because I got fascinated watching the gorillas in their old building – an old-fashioned indoor one with only a cage for outdoors hours – there was an infant, so there was plenty of behavior to watch.
I think her post was before the internet pillorying, so not defensive so much as unthinking. Anyway, understood about the general venting.
So that must mean that God hates gorillas? Because if He was really on the ball, He could have saved both the kid and the gorilla; no need to shoot a member of a rapidly declining species to save a member of the species that is causing their decline. He could have saved them both.
Just so.
Plus her total failure even to mention the gorilla – ick.
Yep. This makes me puke. If god were totally paying attention the kid wouldn’t have gone to the zoo that day.
Clearly she did not keep a tight watch on this one and in the process cost the world a far less easily replaced creature than a human child…
This person and her family should be banned from even being in the vicinity of zoos or, even better, animals.
If I were god, that woman would be a smoking grease-spot on the pavement for insulting me like that.
But of course, being a human being, my morality is far superior to Jehova’s.
Just terrible that she seems to think that the life of a four-year-old child is somehow more important than that of a zoo animal. Now if only it was somone else’s child, maybe she would be a bit more reasonable…
Don’t be so stupid. The point is not that the gorilla’s life is “more important” (whatever that may mean), it’s that she shouldn’t have completely ignored the gorilla and the part she played, however inadvertently, in his killing.
Four-year-olds are wriggly and curious and it’s impossible to”never let them out of your sight for a second.” I got lost on a high street at about that age, and my mother wasn’t neglectful, she was just momentarily distracted by my little brother. And I’ll bet the same happened to most kids at one time or another.
I blame the zoo for not having better protection against children falling in.
@Ophelia
To those of us who eat meat and know where it comes from, the life of an individual animal is of no account in comparison to that of a human being, let alone a four-year-old human being. Should she also have publicly mourned all the animals slaughtered for her family’s dinner table?
This mass outrage over her failure to live up to her social media-defined role is just bizarre.
Am I the only one who thinks far too much vitriol is being directed at almost all the humans involved in this tragedy? Yes, including the mom (or the kid, or the zookeepers, if that’s who you’ve been blaming personally.)
It’s a matter of seconds for a kid to get someplace they don’t belong, in most cases. Short of putting them on leashes (and yes, I’ve seen those), it really is an inhuman demand to insist on absolutely perfect parenting. Hell, I once managed to disappear for hours, sending my entire church into a panic when I was five. Took them forever to figure out that I’d managed to squirrel myself away in the back of a coat closet and fallen asleep–then hid, because I felt guilty about missing Palm Sunday Mass.
Had I been a slightly different child, I could’ve been out the door and down the street into abandoned lots littered with glass and rusty cans in that amount of time. And I was considered one of the ‘good’ kids who would never actively seek out trouble. Fact is, most parents never have to learn how often they got lucky that their kid survived to adulthood.
And do I really need to point out how utterly misogynistic some of this lashing out has been? I’ve seen more than one post online to the effect of, “They should have shot the mother and left the kid with the gorilla.”
And I can guarantee that there’s not a single staffer at the zoo who isn’t in mourning over this. Ripping on them, or the zoo’s management, for the decisions made in a desperate situation is almost as unseemly. (I’ll also note that the zoo has had a 38-year solid safety record; they most likely reasonably decided that their current safeguards were adequate to the task.)
((Okay, ignore the rhetorical flourish at the beginning of this post, since YoSaffBridge @9 managed to ninja me on the sentiment.)
Freemage, no, you’re not the only one – Josh Spokes for one did a thoughtful post on the subject yesterday.
But I’m not sure if you’re saying I and maybe others are directing too much vitriol here? Having seen Josh’s post I tried to avoid aiming vitriol at Michelle Gregg, but I do disagree with the cheerful tone of her post and especially her shout-out to awesome god.
I don’t need to be told the zoo staffers are devastated. I was a zookeeper for several years and believe me, I know that all too well – I shudder to think about how the keepers feel. (On the other hand I was a little consoled when I learned how many gorillas they have, and how recently Harambe had arrived there.)
I know some of the lashing out has been misogynistic, but mine hasn’t, so…? I’m not sure what you’re objecting to?
Jib Halyard, so you’re not at all familiar with ethical concerns about animals that have more elaborate consciousnesses than say cattle? You think of all animals as on one simple level, the not-human level, and as worthless except as food for humans? That’s a widely shared view, of course, but it’s not particularly interesting.
Ophelia:
Sorry for the lack of clarity in my post. I was more or less venting after spending the weekend reading that sort of vile mess, not meant to direct at your post specifically.
I certainly agree with the almost boilerplate-at-this-point objection to “God’s intervention” that never seems to be particularly useful or accurate for an allegedly omniscient and omnipotent deity.
I did read her post with a bit more charity than you, perhaps–I suspect there’s a lot of defensive reaction on her part to the internet pillorying that she’s been receiving, so she’s trying to put on a good face.
I had not known you were a zookeeper; it must’ve been fascinating work.
It was. I decided to get into it because I got fascinated watching the gorillas in their old building – an old-fashioned indoor one with only a cage for outdoors hours – there was an infant, so there was plenty of behavior to watch.
I think her post was before the internet pillorying, so not defensive so much as unthinking. Anyway, understood about the general venting.