The talk was canceled before anyone said anything
McGill Centre for Human Rights and Legal Pluralism advertised a discussion scheduled for today:
The Sex vs. Gender (Identity) Debate In the United Kingdom and the Divorce of LGB from T
About
By Professor Wintemute: Since 2018, there has been a debate in the United Kingdom about whether or not the law should be changed to make it easier for a transgender individual to change their legal sex from their birth sex, and about exceptional situations, such as women-only spaces and sports, in which the individual’s birth sex should take priority over their gender identity, regardless of their legal sex. This debate inspired the foundation in 2019 of an organisation, LGB Alliance, which rejects the political coalition of LGB and T and challenges some transgender demands, on the basis that they conflict with the rights of lesbian and bisexual women or the rights of children who might grow up to be LGB adults.
The Centre for Human Rights and Legal Pluralism took care to disavow their own event beforehand:
CHRLP note: the CHRLP invited Professor Wintemute to give this talk based on his record as a human rights and LGB scholar. We note that Professor Wintemute is also a trustee of the LGB Alliance. The CHRLP does not endorse the views of the Alliance or of any speaker. The CHRLP is committed to a respectful and inclusive space for debate.
Well thanks, good to know you don’t actually mean it about the pluralism, or in fact the human rights.
Speaker:
Robert Wintemute (McGill LLB and BCL 1982) is a Professor of Human Rights Law at King’s College London, UK. Since 2003, he has participated as a lawyer for the applicants or third-party interveners, or as an expert witness, in 15 successful cases challenging discrimination against LGB individuals or same-sex couples in the European Court of Human Rights, the Court of Justice of the European Union, the Inter-American Court of Human Rights, and the United Kingdom Supreme Court. On 23 March 2022, he argued the case of Macate v. Lithuania before the 17-judge Grand Chamber of the European Court of Human Rights (restrictions on a book of children’s stories because it included a princess who fell in love with a woman and a prince who fell in love with a man). The Court’s judgment will be published on 23 January 2023.
Commentator (which here seems to mean dissenter or other side or similar):
Darren Rosenblum. Professor Darren Rosenblum’s scholarship focuses on corporate diversity, with emphasis on remedies for sex inequality. They joined the Faculty of Law of McGill University as a Full Professor in August 2021, from the Elisabeth Haub School of Law at Pace University. Among many other publications, they wrote the first law review article of queer legal theory “Queer Intersectionality” (1994) and the first law review article on transgender prisoners “Trapped in Sing Sing” (2000). They have taught Sexuality, Gender and the Law since 2003 at Fordham, McGill, NYU, Pace and U.Penn. They were appointed Associate Dean (Graduate Studies) in 2022.
A they.
Anyway, it didn’t happen. Instead the predictable thing happened. The CBC reports:
Trans rights advocates stormed into a talk Tuesday afternoon at McGill University led by a speaker associated with a group they say is “notoriously transphobic and trans-exclusionary.”
The talk was ultimately cancelled shortly after it started.
McGill University’s Centre for Human Rights and Legal Pluralism (CHRLP) hosted the event, titled Sex vs. Gender (Identity) Debate In the United Kingdom and the Divorce of LGB from T. It was led by McGill alumnus Robert Wintemute.
…
“The T (trans) is so much more vulnerable than the rest of LGB. I think there’s tons of scientific evidence speaking to that,” said Celeste Trianon, a trans activist who led the protest against the event.
Trianon said Wintemute’s talk excludes transgender people’s rights and is transphobic, further discriminating against the community.
But Wintemute, the man at the centre of the controversy, maintains he does not promote transphobic views and describes the reaction to his talk as “hysterical.”
He says he has a 37 years’ experience defending LGB human rights and he would never associate with any group that “promotes hate.” He said he came to McGill to promote the message that women have human rights too, but they feel intimidated by the trans rights movement.
“So I have to thank the protesters for giving me first-hand experience of that intimidation,” said Wintemute after the event. “Probably the majority of women in this country disagree with some of transgender demands but they refuse to say so because they will be seen as intolerant.”
And mercilessly bullied.
The only way they can show that T faces more discrimination is by stealing the statistics from LGB – such as rates of homelessness for gay males are given as homelessness for trans.
Dishonest. Bullying. Threatening. Entitled.
Oh, yes. Must be women, right?
Citation needed, as noted above. But even if this this is true, so what? People are allowed to talk about something else. In particular, people can talk, as in this instance, about how efforts to cater to this allegedly vulnerable population negatively affects other people. Except you won’t let them.
Seems like TRAs believe and want to
persuade convinceforce everyone else to affirm that only “trans rights” matter. But women’s rights matter. Children’s rights matter. Lesbian rights matter. Gay rights matter. Bi rights matter. Parental rights matter. Yes, even straight, white, men’s rights matter. In short, all rights matter, so long as they are, in fact, rights. This test is somehow consistently failed by TRAs.On the way out from the cancelled event Eliza Mondegreen wrote about the harassment by the Black Pampers, including women being knocked down. These are men who don’t really care so much about the trans issue, as it is an excuse to browbeat and threaten and gays who dare to stand in public against a social trend that is damaging to women’s rights, safety, and freedom.
One of them shouted at Eliza that he used to be a fascist and he recognizes fascists like her. Another said “This isn’t bullying.”
The CBC’s reporting on this was dismal, taking the tack that this was justified because some British officials consider the LGB Alliance a hate group, and including extensive quotes from a trans activist.
https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/montreal/mcgill-backlash-anti-trans-talk-1.6708251
(H/T) Ophelia Benson, of course. A real press would draw the comparisons to the history of the police beating and carrying away suffragettes, but the CBC has revealed it is beholden to the government line of Tranada.
Wintemute is an important voice, that is why they are so angry. He was one of the developers of the Yogyakarta principles, but realised later they had completely neglected the impact on women.
https://thecritic.co.uk/issues/april-2021/the-trans-rights-that-trump-all/
Two quotes staggering to see almost adjacent, presented without awareness of contradiction:
Greenbaum: “It’s just so sad to me that someone who should, in theory, be open to this, is so closed-minded about trans women and has the idea that if you give rights to trans women you’re subtracting from the rights of cisgender women,” she said.
“There’s no ceiling on rights.”
Trianon: “This form of free-speech absolutism: it has an end. One’s rights end where another’s begin,”
Almost like rights actually can run into conflict with one another.
If anyone knows Eliza Mondegreen, she could probably use some support right now. Her Twitter account has been locked down and protected, so I can only imagine she has been under a barrage of fury for posting her experiences.
Meanwhile the world continues to look away and the CBC fails to investigate the quotes by Trianon and Greenbaum, or at least to report what is behind the move by LGB groups and women’s groups to counter the transgender activist claims that there is no loss of rights or safety in giving the trans whatever they want. It’s like there’s a blockade on the truth because it affects women, children, lesbians, and gays.
I don’t know her know her but we talk to each other on Twit – her thread about the screaming “activists” is what alerted me to this travesty. I decided not to cite her because she’d locked her account so I thought maybe she would prefer anonymity for the moment. She was certainly under a barrage of fury at the event itself.
I see what you mean, but thought to mention since this is a pseudonym and not her real name.
And a very good thought it was, too.
I’m concerned for Eliza Mondegreen’s physical safety should some from that mob manage to identify her. I hope she contacts McGill to warn them that their failure to keep the mob at bay will lead to more violence as it’s clear there are people willing to assault those they want to intimidate and shut up.
Wouldn’t it be funny if someone responded to the man shouting he’s a woman by saying “Oh, then make me a sandwich”? Not really – it would be dangerous to say that. These men don’t want to be women in all it entails, only in the sense of being able to violate women’s boundaries and invade women’s spaces.
I’m sure he’d consider it validation.
Mike, Eliza Mondegreen seems to be OK; she’s tweeting and retweeting. Last night she tweeted about a sweet but stinky kitten she’s thinking of adopting.
(The similarity of our nyms is just coincidental, in case anyone wonders.)
Where tf are security and police? The university has put on the event; there should be no question that it is authorized and should go forward. Arrest those violent bullies. Keep them away from the entrance of the venue. The bullies win because security and police let them win.
Good to know, LM!
Though they probably should have anticipated it, in the normal course a McGill centre doesn’t alert security that they will be holding a modest-sized event to do what they are supposed to do. Campus security isn’t exactly equipped with a riot squad. Someone probably should have called Montreal Police at some point.